Sunday, March 17, 2013

Alpha Build 3.2

First of all, thanks so much to everyone who has donated! The response has been fantastic so far and way better than I could have hoped. I really appreciate you guys helping support the game. I've already begun working on some of the high-ranking features (though I may switch my priorities around depending on where the donations go). This round of voting is going to end on 4/15, so expect those features that win to be implemented within a couple weeks afterwards.

HOTFIX 3.2.1 (3/18/13):
- Fixed lock-up issue with the Consumable Store buy/sell menu
- Added a button that you can click to leave the donation page
- Fixed a problem that temporarily disabled hotkeys

Known Issues:
- Closing the breeding or client menu with the monster type selector combo box open will cause a crash (silly problem, but I need to make some changes to how menus are handled to fix it)

 Alright, lots of new gameplay stuff in this one, not too much new art or sex scenes (just a couple of holstaurus animations, still no harvest). Unfortunately I've been working on adding things all day so I've had barely any time to test it. Let me know if you guys find bugs and I'll try to fix them quickly.

 I've made huge changes to the balance of the game, but like I said I haven't been able to test them yet so it may be entirely out of whack. Don't be surprised if the game becomes impossible or EZ-mode out of nowhere.

 - Stat Caps: Monsters now have stat caps. Monsters will always inherit the greater of two stat caps from their parents, as well as an additional amount of stat cap growth. A monster is stuck with its stat cap forever: if you want to get high stat creatures, you're going to have to breed or buy monsters with higher stat caps.

 - Trait Stacking: You can no longer get duplicate traits. Instead, certain traits can stack (ie, breed a monster with Added Value 1 to another monster with Added Value 1 and you might get a monster with Added Value 2, additionally if you were to breed a monster with Added Value 2 to another monster with Added Value 2, you could get a monster with Added Value 4). Traits can stack up to 10. To counteract how potentially powerful this is, HERP-DERP has another horrifying consequence: it will remove all other traits.

 - New Traits: Tons of new traits. They all SHOULD be working, but there's a high chance that some of them might be buggy. Let me know if you find any. - Species-specific Traits: Some traits can only be found on specific monster types (for instance, Greased Lightning can only be found on Catgirls).

 - Increased Client Difficulty: All Clients will now scale up the number of demands they make with your reputation. They also now will request certain stats to be UNDER a certain value. - Debt Payments: Now at the beginning of every month you must make debt payments to Delilah or you'll get a game over (currently there's no penalty with just continuing on after a game over). She starts at 2,000 gil and then doubles her demand each month. It's not necessarily intended for you to be able to keep up with her, as this is just a placeholder for how the actual debt system will work. It's also technically possible for you to beat the game now (and I even added an ending!) if you pay off the entire 10,000,000 gil that you owe to Delilah. I don't actually know whether this would be any fun to do, though.

 - Bug fixes: Tons and tons of little bug fixes and convenience additions. Some things (out of many more):
     - Scrollbar for Clients when their demands fill the entire box
     - "Sell All" button in the Consumable Store
     - Breeding Modifier colors fixed at high values (BMs should also cap at bright green and not get any higher)
     - Hitting SPACE with no windows open will return you to the RanchMap
     - Moving between locations will close all windows
     - Various duplication bugs should be fixed I am sure there are still plenty around, though. Let me know which ones I missed.

 Things that just barely didn't make the cut into this version:
- Shortcuts for the Interaction Menu
- Tooltips to let you know how long actions will take and warn you about incest
- The ability to see your monsters' fertility and pregnancy chance

 Hopefully I didn't forget anything. (Oh, and sorry for the annoying opening plug :P)

 EDIT: Knew I was forgetting something! The animations are frozen in the various monster pens to look like snap-shots. This is intentional: the monster animations were causing lag problems. It does look kind of weird, so this might just be a temporary solution until I come up with a better idea.


  1. in firefox shop broke

    1. Consumable shop? If so, there's a fix I'll be uploading in a few minutes. Hopefully this should work with your saves.

  2. It seems that the animations for the monster when you enter either holding area's aren't working like before. I don't know if that is intended or not. Kinda miss the moving monsters when you go into their holding area's.

    1. Yeah, intentional due to a lag issue when you get a full pen. I might try to find another way to fix the problem (perhaps some animated and some posed, etc).

  3. game seems to be getting a bit polished, the menu adjustments are nice.

  4. The first month is brutal, i can't pass through it doesn't matter what i do, maybe i'm just bad but the max amoung of money i've made is 5k

    1. Hm? First month should require 2k, second month 4k, etc.

    2. While on that topic.... i know this isn't final and not supposed to be balanced yet, but.... the current placeholder maths are a bit scary.

      A doubling each month, and 1 million in total, implies ridiculous price inflation.

      If i had to make a guess, i'd say (assuming three difficulty levels):
      Easy: +1500 payment per month, 100.000 total
      Normal: +2000 payment per month, 200.000 total
      Hard: +2500 payment per month, 300.000 total

      Just rough estimates, to keep price inflation manageable. Plus option to "play on" after one won (not talking about current game, but how it could work like in the future).

    3. The thing is that while the debt payment will be growing at an exponential rate, your ability to make money grows at an exponential rate as well once you get to really high levels of STA and DEX on your monsters. None of it is final, of course, and it will really depend on feedback from people who get to high levels.

    4. Well, thats why i called it price inflation, not debt inflation. It implies that for there to be any chance to pay this, there has something equally inflating on the "income" side... and while "grinding" games (as this is one of them) are known for rapid inflation, the rate here seems reach "ludicrous speed".

    5. I noticed that even in the beginning of the game up further on, the color of the negative modifier is always black. Could you make it so that it starts as yellow and then slowly turn to black as the negative modifier gets more pronunced over time as you gain rep and get more powerful monsters that you breed with. Also, is it possible to change your avatar for the game and to allow the monsters to make you (if you use female (or futa if possible) avatar) pregnant with the monster's child?
      One more thing, what is the time limit for the day? isn't it 22:00 or 0:00?

  5. Cant play on my tablet because of the donation screen. Fix please.

  6. The addition of the stat caps is a good call. The game is way too easy without 'em.

    Getting slaughtered by clients asking for low stats though. Sooner or later the silver and gold both start asking for something low and I no longer have the ability to raise some stats while keeping that (especially FER) low Xo
    And except for DEX and STA, it seems the shop can rarely be counted on to get any monsters that have negative modifiers to lower them again.
    It could just be that I suck at keeping enough monsters with varied bonuses, though.

    1. I realize I actually don't have a monster type in the game for every negative modifier yet (unless you get a monster with Cruel). That said, a way to get monsters with lower stats is to breed new children, as they start with 1/4 the stats of their parents.

      Will definitely look into how to balance this.

    2. Okay, it may not actually be that unbalanced after all, it was probably just a round with pretty bad luck. Maybe there could be some slight modification, but it's not as much of an issue as I probably made it sound.

      Anyhow, as for glitches, I haven't been getting the game-freezing bug, but I am suddenly starting to get one where you can't seem to go to the breeding pen twice in a row (it becomes unclickable until you load/save, or go somewhere else and come back). Not sure if anyone's already mentioned that one, but well there ya go.

    3. I think putting a limit on how low they can request is probably necessary.
      I mean asking for single-digit stats can get pretty ridiculous at times (and if I'm not mistaken from my lurking I've seen people getting requests for impossibly low values too).
      Maybe the limit could a little higher at early parts of the game too, because if there's a request for a monster with something really low and you're not at the point where you can easily breed or afford another monster from the shop, it can really slow things down a lot... for a while.

  7. Got a freeze bug:
    I was in the town and i think came to the store. The entire screen "dimmed" (darker colors) as it does in some cases, but this time it stayed this way. No hotspots were clickable anymore, though keyboard (tried space) continued to work. I basically had to close the game and relaunch (i'm using projector). This happened quite early, i think only day 5.

    Sorry, don't have more specific details available to reproduce.

    1. I'm aware of the cause of the this bug and will get a fix up soon.

    2. Found at least one possible reproducable cause (just reporting, because maybe its one trigger you dont know yet:

      1. go to down
      2. click consumable shop
      3. you will be asked if you want to sell or buy. Instead, close the window with the X
      4. dimmed screen with no mouseclicks working anymore

  8. the auto sort menu for the breeding pin got stuck in mine somehow, to where its open in all other screens and cant manage to close it. i saved and went to re load the game and my save game was gone. no idea if those things are related however. Im using Firefox

    1. If you're using firefox, check the settings and (depending on version - motzilla every version have to move everything to some new place) privacy. Check the settings about if firefox should discard offline data when it gets closed. In early firefox version (pre 4.0 i think) it wouldn't touch flash cookies, but in later versions, removing privacy data on exit, also deletes flash cookies.

  9. Usability problem / feature proposal:

    1. There currently is no way to list monsters in a table, with quick overview about breeding modifiers (like, scrolling through a list, and seeing "Ah, this one improves STA and CHA)

    2. To avoid the lack of this, i then began to make the breeding mods part of the monsters NAME. However, when one names a monster, the just recently shown stats of the monster, are no longer visible. So when naming, one has to remember the stats, before clicking "keep"

    3. Sometimes i forget this, so i looked for a way to rename a monster afterwards - but found no such feature.

    It would be nice, if any of the above three usability probs were addressed (one or multiple).

  10. Well since you said that the game is beatable now, I went ahead and beat it. It took me several hours to make it through, but the ending did make it worth it. Some observations:
    -Stat caps scale too quickly and become largely irrelevant after the first month or two.
    -Some of the new traits are crazily overpowered. Incorrigible and True Breeding are by far the worst offenders.
    -Stackable traits are a great new addition, but the scaling on some of them is a bit much. After stacking 10 Geysers on all my cows I was minting around 600 units of milk a day.
    -The first month is brutal, but after the ball gets rolling it's really easy to make your 10 millions way ahead of schedule. I spent the last 7 or 8 months just clicking my house to advance time. I honestly think that the game should be measured in weekly instead of monthly payments and end at around a third of it's current time span.
    -The late game clients request for multiples of non-stackable traits, but seem to accept whatever you give them regardless.
    -The shop glitches out in late game (or possibly at high reputation?) and starts selling monsters for 1 gold each.
    -Since payments scale exponentially from the initial 2k, the last payment request is for 8192k, when you only have 1810k gold left unpaid.

    All in all though, the interface changes, additional traits, the sense of advancement from annual payments and growing stat caps, and all the other goodies in this patch are really sweet.

  11. The negative requirements of some clients seriously annoy me. I know that there are negative breed mods, and that children start out with low stats, but even then, one can easily get into a situation where one cannot satisfy a client for a long time. I just got a client that wanted "Anything but a harpy" with FER <1. How the hell am i supposed to do this in early game? Everything but harpies starts out with FER above 1, and the shop doesn't sell any monsters with FER 0 or 1.

    - The negative reqs of clients should be much easier to satisfy. Basically, them being "mildly annoying" but not more.
    - There should be a way to reject a client. The downside could be, that the relevant client-slot only gets replaced with a new client, every week, or even every month.

    1. I'm considering adding a "restock" button for clients, that you have to pay for like the store restock button, not sure about it yet though. Maybe instead of money you'll pay with reputation? I'll have to think about how that'd work out.

    2. Hey Hartista, thanks for the amazing update.
      I'm the anonymous guy who suggested a button to decline client requests at a 10% loss of your reputation in the comments page for 3.1. I observe that breeding has become much easier now than in 3.1, but the early game is even more of a restock-lottery now, so that might indeed help a little.

      For players having trouble with the first months, here is a HINT: Keep loading your game and restocking monsters until you can buy some creatures that are not too difficult to sell, that really helps to advance in early game. To give some feedback for the pace I experienced:

      1/24 First bunch of holstauri ready to start breeding, lottery only until here
      1/31 All upgrades, some 10k gil, one quad breeding mod
      2/22 First powerderp ready with all 6 breedings mods teal to green
      2/31 50k gil, just started breading for multitrait creatures starting with true breeding.
      3/07 First multitrait creatures ready: added value+10, geyser+10, mutagenous+10, incorrigible and a few more
      3/19 First million of gil, multitrait creatures have all stats about 850-950, some 200k gil daily income
      I could not mutate or buy any greased lightnings, so that probably would have doubled the income, but it is more than enough anyway.

      Make incorrigible override ALL traits, not only derps and have the higher chance to pass traits stackable so it is not that easy to start breeding from scratch.

    3. Instead of turbonerfing incorrigible alltogether, i think the problem with it is, that it is binary: Either it works 100% or not at all. I think, incorrigible should be stackable, with higher levels giving increasingly higher safety.

    4. Yeah, making true breeding and incorrigible be stackable with a 10% chance to get their effects each stack is one of the changes that I have planned.

      Also, save scumming (reloading your save to get different results from the restock button for free) is not an intended feature of the game and I won't be balancing around it. There's things I could change about the way restocking works in order to prevent players from being able to do it (having each new game generating a seed that will make it so that you get the same results every time you reload, etc), but some people might like having the option to do it even though it makes them dirty, dirty cheaters :P. Perhaps it will be tied to difficulty level once I have difficulty adjustments included.

    5. 10% at level 1 sounds a bit harsh for incorrigible. Another thing to consider is, if the percentage in some aspects could perhaps work as a reduction of effect-strength each time a child is born. That would take even more of the (all or nothing) out.

      If effects are dampened, instead of "either it works perfectly, or not), i'd say 20% at level 1. Else if its binary i'd say start out at 33% at level 1.

      Now, for true breeding this stuff imo could work binary just fine. It could just be a bonus to the odds of feats being passed on - similiar to how "breeding stock" works. While on that note: I think "breeding stock" also is a bit too powerful, and should perhaps start at 40% at level1, instead of 60%.

    6. I think one very important aspect for you to balance things are the time requirements based on DEX and greased lightning. Now it seems you reduce the time cost by a percentage equal to DEX/1000 * 90%. E.g. a DEX of 500 speeds up things by less than a factor of 1.7, DEX 700 by a decent factor of 2.7 and DEX 1000 by a overpowered factor of ten. Have you considered dividing the time reqs by a linear function of DEX, maybe basetime/(1+4*DEX/900)?
      The same thing applies to greased lightning (GL), where the situation is even worse: A creature with GL+10 (-100% time) and DEX 0 (+0% time) can still perform all actions in zero time :D. Maybe GL should increase the effect of DEX in the very same way iron will works.

      And yeah, save scumming is just a trick to get over a too random early game difficulty and certainly not an intended feature, but I mentioned that because it should really help people testing the game ;)
      Re: Breeding stock: I think the natural chance to pass modifiers is already 50%, so 60% at BS+1 sounds fair to me.

    7. (Duh, silly mistake and no edit button. 500 DEX --> speedup ~ 1.82, but anyway. But at least I do have another point to make.)

      Back to incorrigible, I think that if you want to keep your current inbreeding mechanics, then this trait could simply allow higher threshold values to trigger HERP-DERP, so you could breed over more generations before you need to cross with a new breeding line. This way the trait seems still really useful without making inbreeding a feature to ignore entirely.

      Keep up the good work =)

    8. Kay, so i'll take the bait for "what if current inbreeding mechs weren't kept" (even though, i have a feeling this is unprobably to happen, but whatever).

      The problem is that the current gamemechanics strongly encourage one, to keep an isolated pool of monsters, and breet them to awesomeness... with only perhaps restocking from the stock, to get new feats and monster-races.... that is, if it weren't for the "herp-derp" mechanic.

      I'll keep the moral argument out here, and just argue from a game-mechanic and design-tactics POV. What happened here, is that some gamemechanics turned out to be a bit inbalanced. Then a new mechanic was introduced, to punish the player for attempting to benefit from it. Whomever reads this, don't take this personal but: This smells like a hackfix: It smells as if some mechanics aren't that sound, and this then was addressed by punishment of people who'd "exploit" this inbalance. Yes, i know, if it weren't just THAT, things like incorrible wouldn't exist. But even then, it's a bit like making a (gamedesign) bug a feature, isn't it?

      Now, i'm not playing devils advocate (and risking dev-flames) just for trolling. What i wrote so far, is just stating a problem, and the current "fix", and hinting that maybe there are other ways to solve it. Is the only way (or the best way) to encourage the player taking "foreign influence" into their monster pool - just punishment if he doesn't do so? For example, what if "fresh/new" monsters (from outside influence) had some benefical effect on breeding, and/or monsters breeding with the same partner having dimishing returns? I'm not sure how *exactly* this could work in practice.... just saying: You basically want the player to from time to time get "fresh" creatures for breeding.... isn't there some way to benefit the player for this in another way, than saying "If you imbreed, something awful will happen!"?

      This isn't limited to just incorrible.... the problem basically applies to any tactic, where the player tries to get a "perfect pool", and then only has to pick from that pool, without adding fresh blood (which with good planning is possible, while avoiding imbreeding... though, it take some effort).

      I mean, am i not right if i say: The real problem, is that the current mechanics - also breeding mods - make it so that the shop is worth shit except for a rare random new feats and monsters... currently, getting fresh blood has no benefit in mid-game, except of to escape the "herp-derp". I'm not sure if that is a desirable situation in game-design. And no, i can't quickly come up with a "perfect solution" either, just noticing a problem.

  12. A few thoughts:
    1) Some of the bronze missions can be finished with monsters that where just bought.
    2) Thea early maximum stats are very harsh, and can make it very difficult to finish clients if you don't get the right monsters to buy. I've had to restock multiple times just to get one monster that could finish a single silver client at the game's start.
    3) I'd like to start the game using something other then dickwolves and catgirls, any chance we might be able to select one male and one female monster from a list to start the game with the option of making? Being able to freely choose the order you get future monsters would be nice too, especially if you don't like using dickwolves as the only possible male for the majority of the game.
    4) We need some way to control what our clients are after. It is possible given that basically everything that you have access to is random to run into situations where you're restocking the store repeatedly, or trying to get as many kids as possible just to satisfy one customer so that you can move on to another one. Then the next might be trivial to finish. Negative stat requirements are probably the biggest issue. Plus early on it is hard to establish a group of monsters that lets you increase or decrease each stat, and you have to carefully pick out monsters (often requiring game restarts and lots of restocks) just so that you can actually increase or decrease that one stat you need (often ones that the starting monsters are not pre-disposed towards).

  13. Oh, one question, have you ever considered the options of having a male PC?

    1. It'd be possible to breed a monster with a male/futa PC? if yes, any difference with the stat gain and breeding?, like having a hard mode...

  14. Beat the thing (wow that took a long time, lots of spam-clicking to harvest/feed). I ended up managing to get 10,000,000 Gil by late June / early July, although I had to make an extra 8M in the last month because of the overflow.

    I noticed a lot of the things that ... other people I believe already noticed (the shop prices glitching in late months to 1 Gil, and some other stuff).
    I believe I saw somewhere someone already mentioning (which I noticed as well) that when you manage to start breeding in monsters with Greased Lightning 10, it becomes practically arbitrary how much DEX the monster has when it comes to how long it takes them to do things. I think that was prooobably unintended, and the calculation could proooobably be re-adjusted so that it takes 1000 DEX + Greased Lightning 10 to do things in 0 time (and doing stuff with no time passing OP).

    I also noticed that, when I had a bunch of monsters with 1000 in all stats and high growth modifiers (40+), if I bought a new monster with any negative modifiers (I tried it with a butt stallion from the shop with a minus WIL mod and also all 1000 stats (which cost 1 Gil!)) and tried breeding it to any of the OP monsters, their stats would never drop (the other one didn't have No Downsides, I checked). I'm taking this to mean that it's for some reason impossible to lower the stats of these monsters for some reason, even without them having No Downsides or using Horse cum or something (no idea if it's because of their high stats or growth mods, though). Again, didn't seem like that was intended, and I'm assuming it's just another issue with the way stat reductions are calculated.

    1. Okay.... Forget that last paragraph, turns out practically every monster from the shop had Gentle at that point, and that's why.
      On a related note though (and the original reason I was testing it), if I do the same thing with a monster that doesn't have Gentle, it tends to reduce the other monster's stat to 0 in one shot. But maybe that was intended, in which case it's fine (avoidable anyways).

    2. Umm, i don't think that's "intended" but instead just the consequence of an overly simple breeding mod calc. TBH, i haven't gotten this far in the game yet, but suspected that things would end up like this: By strength simultaneusly affecting positive and negative breeding mods equally, it would only be a matter of time, when you can't do any "finegrained" stat adjustments to monsters anymore, via breeding. Because any breed mod, no matter if positive or especially negative, would instantly go nuts in one "shot". Heh, i actually think that this currently may make "too much strength" something to avoid. But since ALL breeding mods are affected by it, thats kinda tricky.

      I think this game needs a rootlevel gamemechanics overhaul, which indirectly breaks mid/lategame savegames (because, monsters would no longer behave according to how you bred them).

  15. I tried breeding a dickwolf.
    I'm a little disappoint.

  16. Inbreeding.
    i know that, as a former animal breeder, it is used in real breeding. the game now does well portraying it, in some aspects. Inbreeding is a real exploit but comes with its punishments if used to often.

    i think it is miss-calculated in this game. i made 2 unrelated lines that both had inbreeding and still got herp-derp. in this situation it would not have been so.

    1. I had similar thoughts when i commented on version 3.1: " I think herp-derp triggering could be done much better if you use some genetic fingerprint rather than a counter, maybe just an array of ten random numbers or so." That was probably not very clear.

      The idea: A simple model for inbreeding are defects that accumulate as recessive traits. For simplicity, those defects can be represented internally by a set of numbers (floats or large integers). These are randomized in the shop and recombined when breeding. If two values are equal in the same slot, you get your defect. HERP-DERP and possibly other penalties could be triggered depending on either the number or the position of your defects.

      You don't really need a diploid representation, it is probably simpler to have just one sequence of numbers per creature and then check for equal slots when breeding. The main differences to the current system are then:

      1) Probabilities instead of deterministic rules
      2) You can more easily prevent inbreeding by pairing non-related creatures
      3) Parent-offspring inbreeding has a higher chance of defects than pairing creatures with common parents
      4) You get a simple and useful representation for the degree of kinship
      5) Should work nicely for any number of generations and breeding lines

      I hope that helps to get some inspiration. Whatever you will decide, Hartista, I am sure it will turn out well =)

    2. i have a question about this exactly. this is a game and based in fantasy, why is there a herp-derp trait in this in the first place? it totally ruins the atmosphere.

      my arguments:
      1: if we're going for this then the dick wolves would kill every female they fucked and the player whenever they fuck her.
      2: they're monster(girls), they've adapted to inbreeding.
      3: such a boner killer ;)

    3. HERP DERP is in the game because I find it hilarious.

      Like honestly the second thing I thought after I came up with the idea "monster breeding sex game" was "if you inbreed them too much they get googly eyes lololol"

  17. Not digging the doubled prices. It's hard to keep up. I'd rather it be a fixed rate or at least be less increased. It's not that much fun having to try to breed the right monsters while at the same time trying to harvest them.

  18. A suggestion here (too lazy to create a LoK account.
    Now, when you breed a monster with itself, it breeds with the protagonist instead, but still gains stats according to it's own traits.
    My idea: give the protagonist stats and traits, influences by what she breeds with (e.g: breeding with a stallion a dozen times gill give her STA+...)

  19. any chance that male monsters could make a female/futa PC have offspring and a Male/futa PC making female animals have offspring?

  20. A thing I found myself doing, when I would start out with the DW's and catgilrs I found myself using a system to keep track of the linage. I would name the cat girls 1, 2, 3, in order I got them. and would name the DW a, b, and c in a similar fashion. whenever one would have a child, (using scratch paper) I would create a family tree, for example DW D(a-3) would tell me the linag of that particar wolf, just from the name. and with the scratch paper, maintain the family tree's so I could avoid the Herp-Derp situation. anyone else do anything similar?

  21. I noticed you can't enter the breeding pit right after sleeping, I often have to go to one of the stables then go.

  22. Suggestion for new monster race, Male and or female Orcs... Also the possibility to create a custom PC? Change gender, skin color, hair color, etc. Just recolors to the two base male and female models perhaps?

  23. Suggestion for a new feature, you could add workers that could be hired to help. They could help you harvest the monsters so it took less time. Maybe give them a leveling system. They also could be male or female.

    1. This is actually an intended future feature. Way down the line, though.

  24. Why no option for F-F-M feature to donate to.

  25. how about a harvest all option? where it harvests one monster to where it maxes out its stamina for the day.

    1. That or harvest several monsters at the same time, if you know what I mean...

  26. A little bird mentioned an update coming this weekend... Is that little bird mistaken?

    1. There is going to be an update later today. It won't be very big, sorry, mostly gameplay changes.

    2. Don't be sorry! Small is infinitely better than zero. Hope all is well in the RL